Juan Cena Character Done?

[Travicity]

WWE may have nixed the Juan Cena character after some new promotional material for upcoming live events no longer lists him as appearing. At some events, Edge is replacing Juan in the main events. As noted before, Juan's debut at the WWE live event on Sunday was considered a trial run but they did have plans to use the character.

NoDq

[JohnCenaFan28]

Yay, I hate Juan. He's just not as good as his cousin John, I hope TNA doesn't pick up Juan.

[deadmanwalkin]

^lulz

[Smartmark]

See, this is the problem with WWE. They are too bound with some wrestlers. It's the Hogan syndrom.
Dowm the road they have to establish new guys. When that's said, I know Cena is a young guy yet, but he needs people to wrestle, as he can't wrestle himself (As this isn't DDT Wrestling in Japan :shifty:)

[ArJay]

See, this is the problem with WWE. They are too bound with some wrestlers. It's the Hogan syndrom.
Dowm the road they have to establish new guys. When that's said, I know Cena is a young guy yet, but he needs people to wrestle, as he can't wrestle himself (As this isn't DDT Wrestling in Japan :shifty:)

Miz, Sheamus, Wade Barrett, ADR, Drew, Cody Rhodes, Daniel Bryan ring any bells? To say they need to establish new guys is just asanine.

[Smartmark]

^^ Some of them ain't even near being a wrestler. Besides, using them as midcarders doesn't help.

[ArJay]

^^ Some of them ain't even near being a wrestler.

?? I take back everytime I've said it in the past. THIS has to be the stupidest thing you've ever said. They're not wrestlers, really? Ooooook then.
And what, do you expect EVERYBODY to jump to main event level? Sure, 4 of those guys are midcarders -now-, but all 4 of them will be main eventers some day. Just cause guys like Sheamus and Barrett skyrocketed to main event level, doesn't mean everybody does. This isn't TNA where already established stars get constant main event pushes while deserving young stars are barely ever seen before they eventually get cut or ask to leave.

[Kenpachi Zaraki]

Miz, Sheamus, Wade Barrett, ADR, Drew, Cody Rhodes, Daniel Bryan ring any bells? To say they need to establish new guys is just asanine.

Gotta agree with SM here, they need to push new guys. Out of all those people only Del Rio stands out as one who has beaten Main Event level guys clean and regularly. With Sheamus they did the entire Cena slipping and Nexus interfering thing, Wade Barrett has never won a clean match apart from Henry and Truth. McIntyre has fallen away drastically and with Cody Rhodes you just get the feeling he can't progress anymore. Miz needed help to beat Lawler of all people so yeah some seriou issues there dunno why they're so fucking scared of putting new guys over

[The Mac]

probably scared they will pull a brock.. get over and leave

[Kenpachi Zaraki]

yeah well you can't let that paranoia kill ur business

[ArJay]

Winning clean is all about how a character is booked. Just because they don't win alot of clean matches, doesn't mean they aren't getting pushed or they aren't over. Sheamus IS over, so is Barrett and so is Miz. Hell Miz is over on his mic skills alone. Just because they need help or struggle to win does not mean they are not over. Vickie Guerrero was over HUGE as a heel when she was GM and she wasn't even in any damn matches. Faces are generally the only ones that need to win cleanly to get over, that and the occasional pandering to the crowd. Not saying heels don't win cleanly ever, but it's certainly not needed to be over.

[Kenpachi Zaraki]

Miz is nowhere near as over as a World Champion should be. Do you see him beating Triple H, Cena or Taker? With barrett and Sheamus you do

[Eyesnsane]

Miz as champ is horrible

[Konan]

completely flop story ,,thanks they kick out.

[Travicity]

The good think about it is that it means that if Miz is champion pretty much anybody could be champion lol Evan Bourne could win it next week :D

[ArJay]

Miz is nowhere near as over as a World Champion should be. Do you see him beating Triple H, Cena or Taker? With barrett and Sheamus you do

But he's still over. Like I said, you don't have to be a strong/clean champion to be over. Heelish tactics and winning by the skin of your teeth are other methods of getting over. With Miz, they're booking him as a weak champion, so he'll draw more heat when he wins. That's still a way of getting someone over.

[Kenpachi Zaraki]

Underdog champ storyline can go two ways: Either he'll get some legit heat or people will just walk away knowing what's gonna happen. The title and MITB were put way too early on him. John Morrison was a better candidate. Also, even Evan Bourne has a clean win over Jericho but Miz doesn't. One of the major things about the great heels is that they could win matches clean too, with the constant cheating and run-in thing like I said earlier goes two ways. WCW tried putting guys like Kidman over through this and flopped.

[ArJay]

People aren't going to walk away knowing what's gonna happen if they book him properly according to what their plans are. The 'E wants people to believe he can lose the belt at any given moment, people aren't walking away from that. Regardless, we're just gonna have to wait and see how it turns out. Right now, it's way too early to know for sure if having Miz as a weak champion will succeed or not.

EDIT: I do however agree that he got MitB and the title too early.

[Konan]

The good think about it is that it means that if Miz is champion pretty much anybody could be champion lol Evan Bourne could win it next week :D

then what about santino marella ..hmm much shocking then miz.

[JohnCenaFan28]

Gotta agree with SM here, they need to push new guys. Out of all those people only Del Rio stands out as one who has beaten Main Event level guys clean and regularly. With Sheamus they did the entire Cena slipping and Nexus interfering thing, Wade Barrett has never won a clean match apart from Henry and Truth. McIntyre has fallen away drastically and with Cody Rhodes you just get the feeling he can't progress anymore. Miz needed help to beat Lawler of all people so yeah some seriou issues there dunno why they're so fucking scared of putting new guys over

Why does everyone think Cody can't progress? I love his "Dashing" gimmick, it's really gotten him over and I can see it as a main event gimmick. To me, he's not only improving in the ring but also on the mic and he does the gimmick so well. Cody is definitely a future main event star, he just needs a solid IC Title reign.

PS: With The Miz as champion, I have hopes that Goldust could win it some day :D

[Travicity]

Well it makes you think that anyone could win the title lol good move by WWE.

[Glorious Maxxwell]

Winning clean is all about how a character is booked. Just because they don't win alot of clean matches, doesn't mean they aren't getting pushed or they aren't over. Sheamus IS over, so is Barrett and so is Miz. Hell Miz is over on his mic skills alone. Just because they need help or struggle to win does not mean they are not over. Vickie Guerrero was over HUGE as a heel when she was GM and she wasn't even in any damn matches. Faces are generally the only ones that need to win cleanly to get over, that and the occasional pandering to the crowd. Not saying heels don't win cleanly ever, but it's certainly not needed to be over.

I COMPLETELY disagree with that... if all you have is clean wins... wrestling becomes an emotionless "real" sport... not to mention, the concept of a storyline, or feud, would exist beyond the one match because you've already established a winner and a loser... a superior and an inferior... and unless every feud has to be the underdog coming back from the loss... wrestling would work in that mindframe... just look at the NWA... before Dusty Rhodes burned out the fans with the Dusty finish (making it look as if something happened, then changing the results, after the fact) Unless it was your big money, or one off match, the heel always, always always used nefarious tactics to get the win, retain the title, what have you...

If you take away that, and do solely clean finishes, wrestling becomes a predetermined MMA, taking away a core feature of professional wrestling... Even the godsend promotion that was ECW tried to do exclusively clean wins for their matches and they had zero feuds or storylines... Hell, Ring of Honor tried to do it to, and the only storyline they had at the time was Christopher Daniel's faction, the Prophecy... who refused to adhere by the Code of Honor... There is no storylines, there are no continual feuds, and most of all, there isn't any heat on your heels, if they don't cheat... Your options as a Booker are drastically limited without such options...

[ArJay]

I think you're disagreeing with the wrong person Maxx. Or, you at least took what I said wrong. Where in ANY of MY posts did I say all matches should be clean finishes? That's just fucking retarded. I am PRO heelish tactics. I even said they help get heels over like Miz, Barrett and Sheamus. NOWHERE did I say a heel needs to win cleanly to be over, Gunner did. It was Gunner who was arguing saying a heel can't get over unless they win clean. Re-read that paragraph you quoted. Especially the last line where I said, "Not saying heels don't win cleanly ever, but it's certainly not needed to be over". Or how about the second line, where I said "Just because they don't win alot of clean matches, doesn't mean they aren't getting pushed or they aren't over." Fact of the matter is, I don't know where you got that I said all matches need to end cleanly out of ANY of my posts in here, but that is most certainly NOT what I said or even implied.

[Glorious Maxxwell]

I think you're disagreeing with the wrong person Maxx. Or, you at least took what I said wrong. Where in ANY of MY posts did I say all matches should be clean finishes? That's just fucking retarded. I am PRO heelish tactics. I even said they help get heels over like Miz, Barrett and Sheamus. NOWHERE did I say a heel needs to win cleanly to be over, Gunner did. It was Gunner who was arguing saying a heel can't get over unless they win clean. Re-read that paragraph you quoted. Especially the last line where I said, "Not saying heels don't win cleanly ever, but it's certainly not needed to be over". Or how about the second line, where I said "Just because they don't win alot of clean matches, doesn't mean they aren't getting pushed or they aren't over." Fact of the matter is, I don't know where you got that I said all matches need to end cleanly out of ANY of my posts in here, but that is most certainly NOT what I said or even implied.

May have quoted the wrong person... lol Things get a little hazy when I passionately disagree with somebody or some opinion lmao

[ArJay]

Fair enough then haha. I understand what you're saying though. Some of the people on hear some say shit that has me just like :o ! Sorry if I came off like a prick or whatever.

[Kenpachi Zaraki]

I never said all matches should end clean but there should be the odd clean win so that the guy is atleast taken seriously

[Konan]

back cena as heel .. i love to see him as heel.